I want to thank you, HaRav Mecharker, for allowing me to post this. It is a travesty and a disgrace that the host of the other blog adorns his loathsome website with a (fictional) image of the holy Rambam, the greatest halachist in the past thousand year, a man devoted to teaching Torah to the entire Jewish nation, whose perspective on life and Avodas Hashem could not be further from these charlatans who defile his personality and philosophy with their perverted misrepresentations. Here are the fiery words of the holy Rambam that scorch the inner recesses of our souls:
"What is the proper [degree] of love? That a person should love God with a very great and exceeding love until his soul is bound up in the love of God. Thus, he will always be obsessed with this love as if he is lovesick.
[A lovesick person's] thoughts are never diverted from the love of that woman. He is always obsessed with her; when he sits down, when he gets up, when he eats and drinks. With an even greater [love], the love for God should be [implanted] in the hearts of those who love Him and are obsessed with Him at all times as we are commanded [Deuteronomy 6:5: "Love God...] with all your heart and with all soul."
This concept was implied by Solomon [Song of Songs 2:5] when he stated, as a metaphor: "I am lovesick." [Indeed,] the totality of the Song of Songs is a parable describing [this love]."
How far this philosophy is from the so-called "rationalists" who would use the Rambam as a cudgel to demolish anything spiritual in our religion!
Thank you hgl for lending your tremendous writing talent to my blog! It was an honor hosting you here. I agree that the Rambam would be aghast at the things that Natan has going on over there. In fact, here we have the great 'rationalist' Rambam giving an extraordinarily strong endorsement to 'fluffy spirituality'! And forget about what they think Shir Hashirim is about!
He has rendered himself irrelevant. First the move to a blog with LESS features (although the unmoderated comments are refreshing), and now this. This post means we collectively finally got under his skin to the point he wants to expel us by means of a typically (for him) passive-aggressive poll asking his audience for their opinion on the matter. We, collectively, put up a good fight. I would say, after my banning, and now this, it is time to leave RJ and let it become the entertaining echo chamber it deserves to be.
I admit to being tempted at times to commenting in some way, I do not, except for one sole response to the post on how false Nathan's stance on "free speech" is. I could see from my vantage point how I contribute nothing of substance they can understand. You could wait for him to ban you, but why belabor things? You have seen, as have I, that there is zero movement or consideration of our arguments. It doesn't matter whether you are polite to a fault or a little edgy like me either.
My sincere goal was tochacha, not just lolz. It was clear long ago that it not possible for them to be receptive of such, no matter how precise we are or how many words are written, and being fired just confirmed for me what I should have seen before and done on my own.
"Natan attaches great importance to the biographical details of Rabbi Duran's life."
This explains everything about him. I had not realized this before. While biographical details of a gadol's life are interesting (I would love a copy of the banned Making of a Gadol), they are of zero relevance in nearly everything Nathan raises as a topic for discussion. It's pathetic. Does anyone seriously believe this deep-seated childish thinking could be altered by us?
Also related to the blog move, the inability to ban individual comments is now coming back to bite him. He no longer can play the free speech card while passive-aggressively banning individual comments by us on a whim, as he did with several of us sharks multiple times. His only to choice is to ban outright. Which he is too cowardly to do without input from his sycophantic audience. Hence the appeal to the mob for mob justice.
the point is mcuh stronger. natan entire worldview is based on his biography, since he got his booked banned everything chareidi is evil. and being that that is the case, he foolishly compares himself to the tashbetz, and concludes that one who is writing a teshuva can be influenced by his happening (רח"ל מהאי דעתיה) .
When there is a tayne that one doesn't know how to learn, it is very simple. This means that he makes tsu-shtells that have no shaychus, and any Mesivta age bachur can shlug him up.
If it is nisbarer that the guy who makes krumme tzu-shtells b`etzem knows how to learn, all this means that he is a mazid and not a shogeg, nafka mina where to bury him...
"The vast majority of people in kollel are not begging for charity".
You need to get out more. Roshei kollellim spend a considerable amount of their time nagging gevirim for support for 'their yungerleit". Everyday another fund raise for a kollel (using the treifoh internet which has suddenly become kosher). Numerous tzedokoh organisations exist merely to support kollellim. How can you possibly write with a straight face "The vast majority of people in kollel are not begging for charity"?
The discussion is not about 'derech kovod' or not. Do you mind if I ask? I'm asking anyway.
'Can you learn'? Do people think 'you can learn'? Because in true yeshivish style you bring in other factors rather than the 'etzem sach' to obscure the conversation and try and flummox your chavrusoh, I mean me. Tzedokoh b'derech hakovod is still tzedokoh you know.
I'm not going to name names on a blog am I? Either of roshei kollellim or of kollellim themselves.
Google adopt a kollel or tomchei yoitzei anglia. Two tzedokoh organisations set up to support kollel people.
Google charidy or charidy extra. UK organisations for socialy driven tzedokoh raising using the treifoh internet.
You write 'is that a problem?'. The debate is not whether it is a problem or not (do try and be precise - its the cornerstone if being 'able to learn'. The debate is over the ridiculously false claim that kollel people are not begging for charity. Of course they are. Endlessly. Via the kollel maybe, not personally. Personally they just ask, or demand, reduced or often no school fees etc due to their position (indirectly forcing others to make up the deficit).
Fundraising is not begging. Who is actually begging in the way you imply? Impoverished and starving, going to door to begging for scraps to be able to continue learning.
There are shnorrers, and there are dishonest people shnorring who portray themselves as kollel men. But these are exceptions. You say they are the rule. You are a liar.
While I work and have never been in kollel, I lived the bulk of my adult life in a charedi stronghold in Israel surrounded by many who who were absolutely committed to the life. Do you live among these people too, or just form your opinions based on what you see online? Because your perception is a total caricature not based in reality.
To extent I interact with you, it's with the understanding I am communicating with a childish, emotional, very angry, liar. And a Hater of Hashem, as per Rabbenu Yonah.
Who said anything about 'begging"? The discussion is over 'tzedokoh'. English may have different words, Hebrew does not. Playing with words. And kollel people do turn up at my door begging. For all sorts of things, health, marrying of their children etc. Maybe not for food but what is the difference? And of course fundraising is tzedokoh. What do you think it is?
Quite apart from the fact that yes, many kollel people's children are only not starving because they are filled with bamba and nash. And yes, in Israel especially many kollel families can only afford decent shabbos meals because of hand-outs .
As for your insults, its the chap that insults that has no proper arguments. Good day.
Is the discussion about "tzedaka"? That is not what you describe. Fundraising is also not nagging. I get calls all the time. I don't feel nagged, even when I don't donate, which is usually the case. You, on the other hand, feel nagged, even when no one is calling you.
When you spin your opponents in circles as much as you do, it is you who engage in argument free rhetoric. I just happen to know of your dishonest nature. There is no point to even trying to dialog with you. So, insults. For all I know, you are Slifkin slinking about here as a sockpuppet. He is a proven liar after all.
Happy, I think this is relevant as support too. I cited it before in my comments at RJ.
Shaarei Teshuva, Gate 3:160 (translation by Feldheim):
The aspect of "haters of Hashem" can also be found at times among those who perform mitzvos and are scrupulous in avoiding sin, both in deed and in speech -- if they are pained and inwardly troubled when their friends engage in Torah study, and it bothers them when others serve Hashem and fear Him.
I want to thank you, HaRav Mecharker, for allowing me to post this. It is a travesty and a disgrace that the host of the other blog adorns his loathsome website with a (fictional) image of the holy Rambam, the greatest halachist in the past thousand year, a man devoted to teaching Torah to the entire Jewish nation, whose perspective on life and Avodas Hashem could not be further from these charlatans who defile his personality and philosophy with their perverted misrepresentations. Here are the fiery words of the holy Rambam that scorch the inner recesses of our souls:
וְכֵיצַד הִיא הָאַהֲבָה הָרְאוּיָה. הוּא שֶׁיֹּאהַב אֶת ה' אַהֲבָה גְּדוֹלָה יְתֵרָה עַזָּה מְאֹד עַד שֶׁתְּהֵא נַפְשׁוֹ קְשׁוּרָה בְּאַהֲבַת ה' וְנִמְצָא שׁוֹגֶה בָּהּ תָּמִיד כְּאִלּוּ חוֹלֶה חֳלִי הָאַהֲבָה שֶׁאֵין דַּעְתּוֹ פְּנוּיָה מֵאַהֲבַת אוֹתָהּ אִשָּׁה וְהוּא שׁוֹגֶה בָּהּ תָּמִיד בֵּין בְּשִׁבְתּוֹ בֵּין בְּקוּמוֹ בֵּין בְּשָׁעָה שֶׁהוּא אוֹכֵל וְשׁוֹתֶה. יֶתֶר מִזֶּה תִּהְיֶה אַהֲבַת ה' בְּלֵב אוֹהֲבָיו שׁוֹגִים בָּהּ תָּמִיד כְּמוֹ שֶׁצִּוָּנוּ בְּכָל לְבָבְךָ וּבְכָל נַפְשְׁךָ. וְהוּא שֶׁשְּׁלֹמֹה אָמַר דֶּרֶךְ מָשָׁל (שיר השירים ב ה) "כִּי חוֹלַת אַהֲבָה אָנִי". וְכָל שִׁיר הַשִּׁירִים מָשָׁל הוּא לְעִנְיָן זֶה:
"What is the proper [degree] of love? That a person should love God with a very great and exceeding love until his soul is bound up in the love of God. Thus, he will always be obsessed with this love as if he is lovesick.
[A lovesick person's] thoughts are never diverted from the love of that woman. He is always obsessed with her; when he sits down, when he gets up, when he eats and drinks. With an even greater [love], the love for God should be [implanted] in the hearts of those who love Him and are obsessed with Him at all times as we are commanded [Deuteronomy 6:5: "Love God...] with all your heart and with all soul."
This concept was implied by Solomon [Song of Songs 2:5] when he stated, as a metaphor: "I am lovesick." [Indeed,] the totality of the Song of Songs is a parable describing [this love]."
How far this philosophy is from the so-called "rationalists" who would use the Rambam as a cudgel to demolish anything spiritual in our religion!
Thank you hgl for lending your tremendous writing talent to my blog! It was an honor hosting you here. I agree that the Rambam would be aghast at the things that Natan has going on over there. In fact, here we have the great 'rationalist' Rambam giving an extraordinarily strong endorsement to 'fluffy spirituality'! And forget about what they think Shir Hashirim is about!
[edited to update bad wikipedia link]
"...perhaps it would be more accurate to say that Natan has turned himself into gourmet shark food."
An even more accurate description of what Nathan did is this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark
He has rendered himself irrelevant. First the move to a blog with LESS features (although the unmoderated comments are refreshing), and now this. This post means we collectively finally got under his skin to the point he wants to expel us by means of a typically (for him) passive-aggressive poll asking his audience for their opinion on the matter. We, collectively, put up a good fight. I would say, after my banning, and now this, it is time to leave RJ and let it become the entertaining echo chamber it deserves to be.
I admit to being tempted at times to commenting in some way, I do not, except for one sole response to the post on how false Nathan's stance on "free speech" is. I could see from my vantage point how I contribute nothing of substance they can understand. You could wait for him to ban you, but why belabor things? You have seen, as have I, that there is zero movement or consideration of our arguments. It doesn't matter whether you are polite to a fault or a little edgy like me either.
My sincere goal was tochacha, not just lolz. It was clear long ago that it not possible for them to be receptive of such, no matter how precise we are or how many words are written, and being fired just confirmed for me what I should have seen before and done on my own.
"Natan attaches great importance to the biographical details of Rabbi Duran's life."
This explains everything about him. I had not realized this before. While biographical details of a gadol's life are interesting (I would love a copy of the banned Making of a Gadol), they are of zero relevance in nearly everything Nathan raises as a topic for discussion. It's pathetic. Does anyone seriously believe this deep-seated childish thinking could be altered by us?
You can get the first volume of 'Making of a Godol' at Lulu publishing for $30.
Also related to the blog move, the inability to ban individual comments is now coming back to bite him. He no longer can play the free speech card while passive-aggressively banning individual comments by us on a whim, as he did with several of us sharks multiple times. His only to choice is to ban outright. Which he is too cowardly to do without input from his sycophantic audience. Hence the appeal to the mob for mob justice.
the point is mcuh stronger. natan entire worldview is based on his biography, since he got his booked banned everything chareidi is evil. and being that that is the case, he foolishly compares himself to the tashbetz, and concludes that one who is writing a teshuva can be influenced by his happening (רח"ל מהאי דעתיה) .
When there is a tayne that one doesn't know how to learn, it is very simple. This means that he makes tsu-shtells that have no shaychus, and any Mesivta age bachur can shlug him up.
If it is nisbarer that the guy who makes krumme tzu-shtells b`etzem knows how to learn, all this means that he is a mazid and not a shogeg, nafka mina where to bury him...
"The vast majority of people in kollel are not begging for charity".
You need to get out more. Roshei kollellim spend a considerable amount of their time nagging gevirim for support for 'their yungerleit". Everyday another fund raise for a kollel (using the treifoh internet which has suddenly become kosher). Numerous tzedokoh organisations exist merely to support kollellim. How can you possibly write with a straight face "The vast majority of people in kollel are not begging for charity"?
A beautiful adopt-a-kollel parlor meeting= דרך כבוד
Grumbling and whining on his website about the "vicious sharks" and then placing a "Pledge your Support" button= not דרך כבוד
The discussion is not about 'derech kovod' or not. Do you mind if I ask? I'm asking anyway.
'Can you learn'? Do people think 'you can learn'? Because in true yeshivish style you bring in other factors rather than the 'etzem sach' to obscure the conversation and try and flummox your chavrusoh, I mean me. Tzedokoh b'derech hakovod is still tzedokoh you know.
Uh, yeah it is
Have you gotten out at all? You sound like your opinions were formed from talking points and newspaper headlines.
He can write it because it's true.
If you're so familiar with all these outrages, name the perpetrators.
<b>Roshei kollellim spend a considerable amount of their time nagging gevirim for support for 'their yungerleit".</b>
Name one, and specify the offences. Of course, you must have witnessed this personally, and repeatedly.
<b>Everyday another fund raise for a kollel (using the treifoh internet which has suddenly become kosher).</b>
Again, name one. Another one every day, by someone hypocritically making use of the internet. Which you know of personally.
<b>Numerous tzedokoh organisations exist merely to support kollellim.</b>
This is a problem?
I'm not going to name names on a blog am I? Either of roshei kollellim or of kollellim themselves.
Google adopt a kollel or tomchei yoitzei anglia. Two tzedokoh organisations set up to support kollel people.
Google charidy or charidy extra. UK organisations for socialy driven tzedokoh raising using the treifoh internet.
You write 'is that a problem?'. The debate is not whether it is a problem or not (do try and be precise - its the cornerstone if being 'able to learn'. The debate is over the ridiculously false claim that kollel people are not begging for charity. Of course they are. Endlessly. Via the kollel maybe, not personally. Personally they just ask, or demand, reduced or often no school fees etc due to their position (indirectly forcing others to make up the deficit).
Fundraising is not begging. Who is actually begging in the way you imply? Impoverished and starving, going to door to begging for scraps to be able to continue learning.
There are shnorrers, and there are dishonest people shnorring who portray themselves as kollel men. But these are exceptions. You say they are the rule. You are a liar.
While I work and have never been in kollel, I lived the bulk of my adult life in a charedi stronghold in Israel surrounded by many who who were absolutely committed to the life. Do you live among these people too, or just form your opinions based on what you see online? Because your perception is a total caricature not based in reality.
To extent I interact with you, it's with the understanding I am communicating with a childish, emotional, very angry, liar. And a Hater of Hashem, as per Rabbenu Yonah.
Who said anything about 'begging"? The discussion is over 'tzedokoh'. English may have different words, Hebrew does not. Playing with words. And kollel people do turn up at my door begging. For all sorts of things, health, marrying of their children etc. Maybe not for food but what is the difference? And of course fundraising is tzedokoh. What do you think it is?
Quite apart from the fact that yes, many kollel people's children are only not starving because they are filled with bamba and nash. And yes, in Israel especially many kollel families can only afford decent shabbos meals because of hand-outs .
As for your insults, its the chap that insults that has no proper arguments. Good day.
Is the discussion about "tzedaka"? That is not what you describe. Fundraising is also not nagging. I get calls all the time. I don't feel nagged, even when I don't donate, which is usually the case. You, on the other hand, feel nagged, even when no one is calling you.
When you spin your opponents in circles as much as you do, it is you who engage in argument free rhetoric. I just happen to know of your dishonest nature. There is no point to even trying to dialog with you. So, insults. For all I know, you are Slifkin slinking about here as a sockpuppet. He is a proven liar after all.
Happy, I think this is relevant as support too. I cited it before in my comments at RJ.
Shaarei Teshuva, Gate 3:160 (translation by Feldheim):
The aspect of "haters of Hashem" can also be found at times among those who perform mitzvos and are scrupulous in avoiding sin, both in deed and in speech -- if they are pained and inwardly troubled when their friends engage in Torah study, and it bothers them when others serve Hashem and fear Him.