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Eli's avatar

Unclear is why @test thinks that halachik infringement of Chassidim is sanctioned by traditional Jewry. It is not. They received their fare share, open a history book. The reason the vehemence leveled off is because of their unbridled passion for yiddeshkeit overall, which is grudgingly acknowledged to have kept many Jews on the beaten path. As the Chofetz Chaim once said they are a mazik bereshus. Modox however are mazikim shlo breshus. It's that simple. This should account for 99% of his comments.

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test's avatar

"In the context of Issur Eishes Ish, Rambam says that it takes effect with the Biah. Inasmuch as the whole context is Ishus, he doesn't mention the details (= the intention) of that Biah. For that you're meant to look in the beginning of Hilchos Ishus."

Classic yeshivish. When it suits, every word a rishon writes means something. And every word that is not written is also significant.

And when it doesn't suit, and a word that should be there to support a 'tzad' is not present, well, the yeshivish response is 'its obvious from the context'. Very weak indeed. I would expect a condition 'lesheim ishus', that creates a chiuv misah of eishes ish for a non-Jew, to be clearly stated. Since when is any 'tanai' in a halochoh left to 'context' to determine? One man's determination from context could be very different from anothers. The context of hilchos ishus (I am not conceding there is a clear context, what is 'context' exactly, and I have NEVER heard a rov create a halochoh from 'context', but even using your argument) is anyway 99.9% Jews, non-Jews have different rules and you cannot (well, people that really know how to learn and want to be mevakesh the emes rather than just demolish an argument cannot) infer one from the other.

It's all amost as good as the classic 'it doesn't not say it', or 'he doesn't not argue'.

At least you have conceded there is no 'mekor'. 'Context' is just a glorified version of 'its obvious'. Too vague to be meaningful. One man's derivation from context could be very different from another.

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